The Hunter skills you never use

[IsmoLaitela]

What hunter skills you find useless? I never use any melee skills apart from low cut and havent even bought these from trainer: strenght of the earth(or something), Stance precision, stance fleet

[Kheld]

Whoa.

Precision stance should be the Hunters default stance in groups v high level mobs.

In precision ive pulled aggro off Hunters in strength.

Strenght of the Earth is also a good skill - becomes very useful with the required number of Traits in Huntsman eliminating the Induction.

Bards Arrow that mob & top yourself up quickly.

Barbed Arrow I+ Scourging Blow I rarely use - unless all the other shots are on CD.

Fleet Stance is a joke.

The 3 capstones Traits I also dont use (after trying them all) - they are not worth the tradeoff from you favourite build.

[Lord_Kolken]

hmmm...i rarely use strength stance. I didn't even bother buying passage of shadows or Fleet Stance.

umm...i use all the others really

[Tawnyn]

i use all my skills at the max except from strength of the earth.

barbed + scourging blow is awesome.

[zimoo]

Strength of the earth is useless IMO, unless you have 3 blue traits and a maxed legacy for it. Then it becomes incredibly useful, and has saved me in many situations :)

I haven't yet purchased Fleet Stance, but I'm tempted to just to experiment with the improved capstone.

Other than that there's not really any skills I never use. Rain of thorns maybe, but that's more to do with making careful pulls than the skill not having a use.

[Malindruil]

Whoa.

Precision stance should be the Hunters default stance in groups v high level mobs.

In precision ive pulled aggro off Hunters in strength.

Strenght of the Earth is also a good skill - becomes very useful with the required number of Traits in Huntsman eliminating the Induction.

Bards Arrow that mob & top yourself up quickly.

Barbed Arrow I+ Scourging Blow I rarely use - unless all the other shots are on CD.

Fleet Stance is a joke.

The 3 capstones Traits I also dont use (after trying them all) - they are not worth the tradeoff from you favourite build.

Well I for one do not use Precision Stance for default.
In Solo hunting/questing I will be in Strength Stance, for extra damage
In FS/Raid I will be in Endurance Stance for Power save, though since BotR got nerfed, I still get 'some' power lose. I will change to Strength only if main Tank goes down and nobody else picks up the target

Barbed Arrow is always on my use list, great on any mob to get some DoT in while at range.

Ye Fleet Stance is a real joke, think they ran out of ideas when they thought of that

Cool Burn is ok for solo'ing when you dont have many mobs to deal with. And nice to see how high you can crit HS with it. Which isnt much now since that got nerfed too

[Scappydog]

I rarely use the Tracking Skills.

I only have 2 Melee skills equiped. Swiftstroke for parry buff and Blindside for focus.

I rarely, if ever use use Barbed Arrow.

Heartseeker only used as an opener against tougher mobs when soloing.

Never bought Camoflague (sp).

Have never used any of the New Legendary traits. Still using the same 3 I did in SoA. I refuse to even buy Fleet Stance.

Corruption removal on MS is fairly useless.

I will not go ToF line and lose Pen Shot.

So many of the new and old traits are useless/pointless.

So many of the Legacies are useless/pointless.

Since our damage drop, there isn't much point to the threat reduction from Endurance. In fact I rarely even use it now, unless I need to conserve power.

Our cc still works fairly well when soloing, but I've found in the harder instances that it is now effectively useless. Far too many immunes,resists and bpe's.

ISB, debate still on as to whether it is an 'improvement' or not.

[IsmoLaitela]

Camouflage is good in PvP if you have the stealth legacy on your legendary weapon like i have and miners charm for +2 stealth level

You can stay in sneak and wait for lonely greendots to come ;)

[Scappydog]

Since I never PvP, it is useless to me.

[nightbyday]

Since I never PvP, it is useless to me.

I use camoflage all the time in PvE...

Activate ... Bio time :P

Seriously i also use it moria in instances when someone pulls etc (just in case :D)




I use all skils on and off but not fleet stance

[Scappydog]

Seriously i also use it moria in instances when someone pulls etc (just in case :D)


I'm a hero..I go down with my fellowship :)

[Elelros]

I think I use all my skills tbh... certainly find them all useful.

As for fleet stance, I dont find it useless, it is however kinda underpowered. But it can be quite useful for kiting.

[European]

I have tried all of the skills I think. Only regular skill I don't have even slotted is camouflage, and I only use improved fletstance and cold burn as experiments. I never use precision stance. Since I hav close to max agility, and hitting is no problem, the only use I would have for precision would be in combination with that huntsman trait that gives focus. I don't feel any need for more focus most of the time, so I use strength or end, if I need power or to deaggro.

[Vaupell]

i only use strength for solo and Endurance for team.

rest of the stances i donot have any use for, and dont use for any lvl quest either.
So i never use

- Precision
- Fleet
- Coolburn
---------

And WERY rarely use "Passage of shadow" most tracking nature or Foes.
Come to think of it, i have never ewen attempted to use passage of shadow.

[NStoianov]

As a lvl 56 hunter i never use:

Fleet stance
Strength of the Earth
Set Snare - the Trap doing dot
Camouflage
Needful Haste
Cry of the Predator - the one that scares beasts - i use it very very rarely.

Melee skills i find extremely useful since i entered Moria. Swift Stroke gives evade chance for when im fighting 2 mobs. Blindside deals massive damage and gives focus to loose a penetrating shot also dealing great damage - so that's a combo i use all the time. Scourging Blow and Agile Rejoinder are skills doing high damage and don't have to wait for next attack - they hit the moment you press the button. Plus if you take a good main hand legendary weapon with nice legacies boosting crit chance - melee fighting becomes real fun.

[aethelhelm]

fleet stance, utterly useless, but pretty much everything else gets an outing from time to time as there are just odd occasions when they can be useful

[Divona]

As a lvl 56 hunter i never use:

Fleet stance
Strength of the Earth
Set Snare - the Trap doing dot
Camouflage
Needful Haste
Cry of the Predator - the one that scares beasts - i use it very very rarely.



Needful haste are you serious? Its one of the best skills. I have also trait + legacy that extends its duration and when its up not a single hit will set back my bow induction skills - it means i can shoot even swift shot in melee range when i have many mobs hitting me :)

[Scappydog]

Agree Divona, I find it very handy, especially with the maxed out legacy.

[NStoianov]

I find Swift Bow to be a joke really. Most melee skills do twice the damage Swift Bow does and they don't have push-backs.

[Scappydog]

Just curious, which melee skill does twice Swiftbow damage? My ISB usually hits for 800-900 damage non crit.

[agoracy_]

I find Swift Bow to be a joke really. Most melee skills do twice the damage Swift Bow does and they don't have push-backs.

I think he is referring to barbed arrow? Swift bow is one of the best shots I have, definitively better than BA. Haven't bought yet improved swift bow though... :D

[Scappydog]

Well be warned, there is some debate as to whether it is an improvement over Swiftbow or not. Prior to Book 7, no contest. Post Book 7, the third arrow usually does less damage than an auto-attack. The testing done by players in US seems to show that any difference between the SB+AA and ISB is marginal. It really is hard to say if a marginal, hard to measure improvement is really an improvement at all.

[Telaron70]

Always Slotted: Bards Arrow, RoT & BoR

Used all the time: QS, ISB, PS, Needful Haste & Intent concentration (traited).

Used Occasionally: Trap/Snare, MS (for that flashy finish that often as not fails to finish them off post bk7), HS and woot!....even Barbed Arrow when the urge to press something different overwhelms me.

Rarely Used: SoE, Camouflage (mainly for when I need to go raid the fridge for a beer whilst in the middle of an Orc camp)

Beneath notice, cry of predator, blindside (for focus) & various melee skills used situationally - I don't PVP much.

DF is a nice travel skill

Any not mentioned above are probably considered too pointless to even bother remembering

[NStoianov]

I find Swift Bow to be a joke really. Most melee skills do twice the damage Swift Bow does and they don't have push-backs.

Actually its my mistake. I was thinking of Quick Shot and not Swift Bow. Improved Swift Bow is definately a nice skill. However Swift bow at lvl 50-55 before it gets improved does about the same damage as Blindside, and if one of the shots misses or get evader/blocked ......

[MéLAnoR]

i dont use quick shot , never ; instead i spam Barbed arrow till the mob dies.
uber hint : Disable autoattack following skills so that you can spam barbed arrow eternaly.its kinda overpowered actually.

[enaking1]

you MUST use strenght stance it gives ur quick arrow 40 % slow its a genius thing if u dont wants the enemy to get to close

[MéLAnoR]

you MUST use strenght stance it gives ur quick arrow 40 % slow its a genius thing if u dont wants the enemy to get to closewell but i put barbed arrow on da target and simply watch it dying and also there is a bonus awesome %10 slow which i kite my target whilst Dot kills it.

[nicbass]

i dont use quick shot , never ; instead i spam Barbed arrow till the mob dies.
uber hint : Disable autoattack following skills so that you can spam barbed arrow eternaly.its kinda overpowered actually.

I use it to slow mobs in Strength stance, & to reduce threat in Endurance stance. Very handy skill.

I never use Fleet stance (especially as you look like a demented Kung Fu Panda) or Set Snare.

[MéLAnoR]

I use it to slow mobs in Strength stance, & to reduce threat in Endurance stance. Very handy skill.

I never use Fleet stance (especially as you look like a demented Kung Fu Panda) or Set Snare.
Does threat reducing effect works when you solo too?
if so finally i can swap barbed arrow ( rumours say its gonna be nerfed anyways) with quick shot on my skill bar and enver gonna suffer threat while i play solo !
woopppieee!:clap:

[Telaron70]

well but i put barbed arrow on da target and simply watch it dying and also there is a bonus awesome %10 slow which i kite my target whilst Dot kills it.

Mel

I can see you are in a very...ermm... fractious mood today :p

You know as well as I do that the best way is to spam HS & kite. That way u get to see the mob wear his legs down to bloody stumps during the 5min cool down. There are several data parses on the US servers that prove this is the most effective tactic ;)

[Scappydog]

With the number of AE mobs, the best way is to run up and hit them with an axe.

[Telaron70]

With the number of AE mobs, the best way is to run up and hit them with an axe.


Eureka.... Uppercut FTW :D

[MéLAnoR]

Mel

I can see you are in a very...ermm... fractious mood today :p

You know as well as I do that the best way is to spam HS & kite. That way u get to see the mob wear his legs down to bloody stumps during the 5min cool down. There are several data parses on the US servers that prove this is the most effective tactic ;)
you beat me to it :D

[Hardowise]

Tracking skills and camo are excellent pve, pathing elite camo let it past and carry on

I never use fleet stance - 9 seconds of being able to run?? whats the point

scourging blow - pointless

agile rejoiner - needs a visual to let u know its popped to hard to see on a 24" monitor in combat

swift stroke - in the dps down time it takes to put it on you have taken more damage than it stops you taking, mob dies quicker without it, needs to last longer to be worth using

burn - pointless skill, just for show offs, no real use in a raid or group or solo

heartseaker, only of use as opener solo on sig mobs, and making babys sorry monsters run away in pvm

bright campfire, does not scale with level, just eat food and get 100 times more regen out of combat

strength of earth - to slow, way way to slow to regen, you may as well use endurance stance and never stop dps'ing (weapon added heal is also pointless) it should match OOC regen imo

merciful shot - pathetic damage for the focus requied, 2 pen shots do more for 60% of the focus, only usefull for debuffing a mob

low cut - was good in pvm got nurfed, pointless now with any sort of lag and the rubbish range on it

barbed, only on bosses

i use all 3 stances pretty equally and blindside which is one of our best skills solo

[nicbass]

Does threat reducing effect works when you solo too?


No, but funnily enough, it works on boss encounters :p

[BinabikErebor]

Never used Fleet stance -- haven't found a practical use for it yet.

Used strength of the earth -- it's nice, to have a big self heal (which I don't have as a dwarf hunter) but switched traits now ..

I don't see the use of "Burn Hot" yet.. I don't like the idea to be out of power at any time.

set snare -- I always use the trap..

and I even forgot the name of those other melee attacks.. blindside and low cut are useful, the others -- hardly ever use them.

**********************

Most useful :

Endurance Stance when fellowed
Strength and Precision when soloing
damage : Penetrating shot, Swift Bow, QuickShot
CC: Barbed arrow, Rain of Thorns, Bards Arrow, Distracting shot (love that one :)
Beneath notice (when I kite in an enemy for the melee to deal with -- e.g. V2B5C5 -- and I quickly want to get rid of it )


but THE MOST IMPORTANT ONE

FIND THE PATH -- everyone in the fellowship loves that one (and tracking skills if you have a hard time locating that sharddropper)

Binabik

[Nyadach]

Barbed arrow - utterly useless when over its time on a mob, the bleed will only total an average of 360 damage...the time to fire it is to long and thus for that amount of damage a bigger hitter is more worthwhile.

Merciful shot - average hits produce less damage than a single Penetrating shot or a blindside, throw in the fact that for the focus and power used you can do a lot more damage with multiple penetratings than a Merciful. Even if the Merciful crits, its only going to work out the same damage from the number of Penetratings hitting at average damage for the same amount of focus.

Fleet Stance - I'm glass artillery, I ain't going anywhere!

Desperate Flight - Yeah yeah, I know...but really don't use it in any fellowship or raid situations unless its for a specific task for the group. Using it otherwise is frankly unfair to the others dying. Only really used for shot cuts when running around.

Strength of the Earth - removed from quickslots as pointless. A hunter not doing damage is no use to a fellowship or raid. It's what icpr is for.

[Scatha the Worm]

Barbed Arrow - No need for an Explanation, but will say it one more time: Double tick damage and duration, and apply bow damage type to it.
Scourging Blow - Mostly because of above, and that building in any sort of fashion for melee damage feels dumb to me.
Swift Stroke - CC is a much better way of improving avoidance (of damage) in any situation. It's not like this skill makes any real difference in day to day solo work (In group work ALL melee skills are useless, except maybe Blindside). But that might be just my playstile mostly...
Campfire - OOC regen by this is so low that it is insignificant, and hence pointless.
Fleet Stance - ... explain to me why RKs have a full line of skills usable on the move and we need a stance to just be able to auto-attack on the move with about 30% miss chance tho, and a legendary to be able to stay more than 10s like that.

Many other skills I feel need serious revisiting, although they aren't completely garbage...
Burn Hot: power penalty is overcharged, no power pool can sustain it
Strength of the Earth: useless unless using improved version, that can't be right. And ICMR should be changed to ticks per second just like power.
Merciful Shot: Should have some base increased crit chance, like Blade of Elendil.
Heartseeker: Lower induction, 3s.
Camo: make it usable on the move, although at -35% speed or alike, or with a max stealth duration of 20s or something.
Press Onwards: normal version should be as the improved one, and improved should lower cd and/or lower induction.
Needful Haste: Should buff ICPR something like +300 (since the faster attack speed hurts badly regen, and would count as giving us a tiny minor help with power problems), and instead of the useless barbed arrow induction reduction (even if the bleed was as I said above, who would spam it? you just need to apply the dot every now and then), and change it to a QS -0.15 induction time.
Improved Swift Bow: Complete Unnerf. Global DPS drop is enough.

And several traits that also need help:
- Barbed Fury: It would be ok if Barbed Arrow got changed as above.
- The Quality of Mercy: 1 less focus and 10% increased crit chance for MS.
- Hail of Arrows: +15% crit chance instead of the dumbass cap-hitting crit rating.
- Shot through the heart: +5% crit chance instead of dumbass cap-hitting crit rating.
- Bow and Blade & Rapid Recovery: I just don't see the melee skillset improving in anything with these two, and I really don't care to see it improved either. Just ditch these, and add something useful with is utilitary to survival and/or ranged DPS.
- Explosive Arrow: make distracting shot cooldown=duration=30s.
- Improved Fleet Stance: ... whatever. Needs a complete overhaul and rethinking of the base skill.
- Bow of the Righteous: Complete unnerf.

That's about most of it... Probably more stuff I can't remember right now.

[James_Ross]

That's about most of it... Probably more stuff I can't remember right now.

/applaud Scatha
I think you pretty much just summed up what every hunter should want for this class.
Needful Haste is okay I think, there needs to be some penalty for an increase to dps and its quite minor. Agree with all the others though, plus the following...

Scourging Blow - with BA on the target like this to have 50% chance for 5s knockdown.
Swift Stroke - have this work on %'s and not rating, partial parry's are near worthless.
Camo - fine stationary but should buff crit chance and magnitude (obv only your next shot).
Heartseeker - lower induction (3s) AND lower cooldown (3m)

[Nyadach]

explain to me why RKs have a full line of skills usable on the move

Because they added the RK to try and get WoW players to join here so made it utterly over powered and unfitting the game or lore in the search for higher subscriber numbers...which resulted in nothing but tick off the current playerbase.

[agoracy_]

Because they added the RK to try and get WoW players to join here so made it utterly over powered and unfitting the game or lore in the search for higher subscriber numbers...which resulted in nothing but tick off the current playerbase.

You don't know if the add of RKers offered a reason for WoW players, or any other MMO players join LOTRO... but one thing is for sure, hunter is/was the most played class so far, maybe because there are more people focused on DPS rather than support (buffs/debuffs). I won't let my hunter being forgotten and switch to a RK, just because they have a higher DPS, a better versatility....

I have decided to play as hunter because I am a huge Tolkien fan, and elves archers were my favorite. They were fragile, but deadly and this is the true nature of a hunter... they have to kill fast, or die fast, they have to help people being in the frontline kill their foes faster. But I won't open this subject again.

Give back my bow master, give a better version of BA... Give us a better version of the hunter, nerfing a class for marketing purposes is like telling your clients to pick another menu because the pizza you are serving is cold...

[Nyadach]

You don't know if the add of RKers offered a reason for WoW players, or any other MMO players join LOTRO...

Hmm thinks Turbine, looksee here, WoW has this thing thats become very popular called a Shaman, lets rip it off and rename a few things and stick it in here and change its totems to rocks. Hmm, a new profession which breaks the lore, breaks the game, and is glitzy and spangly to appeal to the folks the WoW players. That'll surely up the subscription numbers!

DOH! forgetting one minor thing there Turbine, WoW already has it, thereby ripping off something from WoW won't bring in users, since they already have one!

And yes, we'll never be able to get directly inside the heads at Turbine and know for a fact why they added them. But they utterly stick of marketing department!

but one thing is for sure, hunter is/was the most played class so far, maybe because there are more people focused on DPS rather than support (buffs/debuffs). I won't let my hunter being forgotten and switch to a RK, just because they have a higher DPS, a better versatility....

DPS classes are always popular, its the whole fact of making things go away rather than having to sit there and take a beating or gopher around after others that seems to appeal to people. Four of my last six mains in various games have been DPS classes, and yes fine other games did bugger around with damage levels. Yet no where near as often as Turbine does to us.

Anyhow, back on topic...pretty much all melee skills are a waste of space for a couple of reasons. High power costs, low damage output, no focus from them. Ok, a few exceptions, but must that pretty much covers.