Fast Draw trait slotting 66 silver !

[MéLAnoR]

Fast draw ( actually it's not so fast, a nerfed trait of hunters) costs 66s everytime you slot it when you visit a bard.This is wrong ! Why do we pay this high everytime we want to change our trait order?
Yes ,we should be able to change our trait order anytime we want ,it's designed as this way isn it?
But it'S ridicilious to pay that high with this new hardened economy !
please fix this , you may not need those traits at first but on higher lvls you'll need different tactics esp in ettenmoors.

[Riffie]

I agree, I just got that one too, and I was like "woooot???" when the 66 silver price popped up :(

Also money is really hard to get at this point, I had just past my first 100 silver, then I had to buy skills in lvl15 + this class trait for 66 silver which left me with .... like no money :(

Well thats part of the game so I'm still happy :D

[Vodos]

To add insult to the injury, my LM's lvl 15 trait cost only 11s...

[Heimer]

Yep I agree its way to high :-(

Cant afford to slot it atm.

[MéLAnoR]

it's not just the first time to pay 66 siver ,everytime you change your traits and slot fast draw again it costs 66 silver !

[Belechael]

Thanks for posting this in a new thread, 'cause I was too angry to do it myself!

I'm having an amazing adventure in the game so far, but the economical values in every aspect are just plain wrong. We knew this from the beta, but I hoped that Turbine would fix it.

Crafting is impossible (I'm just collecting wood at the moment, as 1 Wax costs 48 copper, and you need something like 300 Waxes to reach mastery in the 1st tier), I can't get all my skills at level 15 (extra weapon proficiencies), the bards are killing me with their prices (I've got over 8 traits and I just can't rearrange them), the Auction House is a mythical place, and I haven't gotten a couple of purple items yet to check their repair costs (in beta many players didn't use them, because their repair costs were very high for what they did).

So, this is just the tip of the iceberg.

Oh, and to make my case clearer: I've "wasted" almost a day hunting low level mobs just to get some money. Hopefully, a hunter can kill them before they even scratch his armor, therefore he won't have to lose any money on repairs. If it wasn't for the traits you gain by killing specific monsters I would be bored as hell.

Where do we start a formal petition to change things?

[Jessie]

it's not just the first time to pay 66 siver ,everytime you change your traits and slot fast draw again it costs 66 silver !

Why after putting this Trait into a Slot would you want to remove it again? If I recall it the Trait that reduces "Draw Speed" on two of the skills? or is it that when I next speak to a Bard this skill will "de-slot" itself and I'll have to pay to "slot" it again?

[Takagi]

Yea will admit some Skill and sloting prices do seem a bit high, but hey-ho just means gotta farm some more

[Belechael]

Yea will admit some Skill and sloting prices do seem a bit high, but hey-ho just means gotta farm some more

If it was just that then none of us would be complaining. I wish it were that simple.

The problem is the general economy and the algorithm they use for it. After the last patch everything changed making money scarce in a lot of ways:

1. Repair costs
2. Traveling
3. Trait equipping
4. Vendors lowering the prices they buy

Sum all these up and you get the picture.

Of course, some are saying that they have a lot of money (compared to the others, of course), that they have bought every skill they had, crafted, and were left with a considerable amount for their next level/rank, which leaves me to think that I'm missing something here.

Anyway, I've asked people to write a more detailed log of their whats and hows, so that I may eventually figure it out, but until then I have at least 10 friends of mine in the same miserable situation that I am. Different classes, different vocations, different starting areas, but same result: Poor...

[Shariva]

Of course, some are saying that they have a lot of money (compared to the others, of course), that they have bought every skill they had, crafted, and were left with a considerable amount for their next level/rank, which leaves me to think that I'm missing something here.

Anyway, I've asked people to write a more detailed log of their whats and hows, so that I may eventually figure it out, but until then I have at least 10 friends of mine in the same miserable situation that I am. Different classes, different vocations, different starting areas, but same result: Poor...


Hmmm, I only had this problem because I spend my first 10 levels out of the newbie area in a fellowship. Fun as hell, but I didn't make enough money to repair my armor or equip traits. Then I decided to make it on my own for an hour or two farming mount wights at the Emyn Hoedh. I spent like an hour there shooting down every wight I could get my arrows at and ended up with stuff selling for like 200 silver. Off course I had to repair my armor after it and that costed me like 50 silver. So I ended up with a netto profit of 150 silver. That allowed me to by skills and equip the traits I wanted.

Basically I learned that travelling with a fellowship is fun and get's you XP fast (because of completed quests and mobs the fellowship kills like crazy), spending a little time alone hunting mobs like wights, brigands and orcs, is profitable in the sense of money making. It also gives you treasures that can be used in crafting that you can sell at the Auction House or by trading with someone.

All of the above now left me with like 100 silver in the game so I think I'll be hunting the barrow-downs tonight to make me some money. :D

And another little advice: do not repair your armour until it starts showing up yellow. Before that, it's just not worth the effort.

[Abel]

Hello !
I must say all is more expensive, however I had JUST enough money to buy not all the skill, but the one that I wanted.
The travel prices are nonsense !
Regarding the Fast Draw trait, I'm rally disapointed, I did not notice any difference for the skills' quickness.

[harde]

I'm leaving the traits totally unused at this point, doing just well without them. Trying to save for the mount (little over 1g now at level 20).

[Suburbian]

it is quite ridiculous...

[WiteBoi]

ill say :P

[ApollyN]

I think its been mentioned before but some solo playing really boosts your income. I normally average around 200 silver come lvl up time and at lvl 20 this wasnt really sufficient for me to get all the skills I wanted. However, just a cpl of solo quests later I was up to around 150 again and could get what I needed slotted up.

Fellowships get ur good gear and stuff but they are not so hot for the cash.

Also, dont repair until you have too. Sounds obvious but seriously, have you got a quest to do that gets you new shoulders or whatever? Go do it, make some money off it and save on the repairs. I try to change gear enough to not repair it as thats the real money killer it seems. Besides, skills scale for your lvl so unless its a crucial one dont rush to slot everything out with poorer traits and stuff just cos they are available. Is that race trait really any use (uppercut anyone?) that its worth that silver investment?

[Belechael]

After reading a lot yesterday (nothing else to do since the servers were down), I came to the following conclusions:

1. At the 1st 15 or so levels you must not group with others, unless it is a Fellowship quest, and then not with many. I went to kill Jasper with a full Fellowship (6 people), and even though it was very fun the loot was non existent.

2. You must not repair items at all until they are almost broken. Chances are you will replace them soon, and you might even plan this by choosing appropriate quests accordingly.

3. Do not pick a vocation with a profession that requires items that you can only buy from vendors and sell everything else. Woodsman for example is a bad choice, as you need treated rowan to make staffs and hafts and you must buy wax from a vendor. Explorer on the other hand is great, because you can advance in Forester by boiling leather you find, make ingots from ore for the Prospector and sell every wood, ingot and boiled leather for a nice profit without any costs at all.

4. Forget about your friends and Kinship. Sell everything and don't try to trade recipes and ingredients with them. It's a waste of money anyway, as you are going to get better equipment from the quests and drops. By the moment you get the Heavy Ash Bow recipe you are probably already using Thornely's bow and so on.

5. Collect traits but don't equip them, or just pick a couple (definitely not Fast Draw ;) ) and try to raise those only, so that you won't have to pay the Bard any more gold for rearranging them.

6. It goes without saying that Horses are mythical creatures, avoided at all costs, Purple is the color of Sauron, and Guardian is just a nice name for a pet only!

"What?" you may wonder, "This was supposed to be a Fellowship game!", or "Why then have all these professions if we effectively can not use them?", or "How am I supposed to keep track of all my quests in order to avoid repairing my items?", or "Why did they put all these traits then?", etc, etc.

Well, tough luck ladies and gents, this is life... not the real one, but close enough.

So far I've only read posts from 2 players that actually provided info on how they managed to have sufficient gold to fully repair their items, buy all of their skills, slot all of their desirable traits whenever they wanted, gained ranks in crafting (one of them actually by buying ingredients from vendors), occasionally used horses, and then have quite a few silvers for the next level.

Sure, you can read several posts from players claiming to have done the same things, but without bothering to enlighten the rest of us, so I won't even bother with them.

Bottom line is, if you want to have fun with your friends (this is a MMORG, or should be), play as fast as you can to reach 35, because according to the old beta testers who reached those levels, you can only play in a large group after that...

... or give it a rest.

I know I will try it for a month (I'm getting the retail version, after all), and then who knows?

PS. Oh, and I forgot to mention: Don't die. At all. Never. It's bad for your wallet. [/sarcasm]

[Larinson]

I think they tried to balance the money as in beta it was pretty easy to get a lot of money. I think by the time I hit lvl 28 I had around 5 gold, without consciously trying to make money. Naturally I had nothing to spend it on other than the occasional skill, occasional equipment upgrade and the odd repair.

I can't really comment on the state of it at the moment, as I'm only level 11 - but I have noticed that I am running out of money more quickly and can't afford to buy all my skills at leveling. But it hasn't affected me too badly yet...

[Vodos]

It really starts getting better around level 22+. You don't get as many new skills anymore, leveling takes longer, you kill more mobs, get more vendor trash. At level 30 I'm sitting at 1.5g (after buying skills), and I gave all resources (I'm explorer) and plans to my guildies, the only things I've auctioned are a few yellow items.

[Belechael]

It really starts getting better around level 22+. You don't get as many new skills anymore, leveling takes longer, you kill more mobs, get more vendor trash. At level 30 I'm sitting at 1.5g (after buying skills), and I gave all resources (I'm explorer) and plans to my guildies, the only things I've auctioned are a few yellow items.

Really hopeful information my friend.

Could you please elaborate on your playing up to that level though? How are your crafting ranks? Are you a loner or do you group with friends for quests, and if yes how often? What are your repair tactics? Do you have purple items, and if yes, how much do they cost compared to the yellow ones? Are you rearranging your traits, and if yes how often? How about the other class traits? How much do the cost? What about the race traits?

Sorry for this avalanche of questions, but just doing all right at a certain level is unfortunately not enough for me, and I'm guessing for several other players. I don't want to play Lotro for the feeling and WoW for fun with my friends. Call me selfish but I want both here.

[Vodos]

Could you please elaborate on your playing up to that level though?
Never ever ever do "Repair all" - NEVER!
Until level 20ish your only expense should be skills, maybe wax if you're treating wood - but I wouldn't recommend that. There's no need to take horses (except to get to Bree from your starting area at lvl 14-15). Be smart about what passives you buy, unless by some miracle you have an exceptionally good mace you don't need to buy club/mace/hammer/spear passives, improved traps/oils are not needed at those levels and cost extra silver.

The biggest money sink besides repairs is crafting. Many hunters take up woodworking so they can make their own bows. Works in theory, but... most players also only pick up any resources they find while questing. This will never be enough to make anything appropriate for your level. You'll need to spend a good portion of your play time (probably 30-40%) gathering to make stuff that's somewhat better than quest rewards.

Anyways, the point is that people spend silver on stuff like wax, cloth, coal, maybe buy some recipes or even resources on the AH, but it doesn't really help them advance because they also spend too little time gathering resources. So they're wasting their cash and don't have enough to buy skills. Of course this is different when you have 2-3 people in your kinship giving you resources, you will be able to make useful items.

The only crafted bow I used so far is a lvl 27 bow, which I used for 2 hours at lvl 29 before getting my lvl 30 quest crossbow. The only reason I had that bow is that we had 2 Explorers dump all their wood on one woodworker. Of course I'm more of an exception because I played a lot since Friday afternoon. Players leveling at a normal rate (around lvl 20 by now) and pooling resources will find more use for crafted items.

I guess what I'm trying to say is, crafting at low levels is risky. You have to either have people who provide you with free resources or spend a lot of time purely gathering. There's also the fact that other low level players have as little money as you have, so who's gonna buy your stuff?

How are your crafting ranks?
I'm an Explorer (Prospecting/Foresting/Tailoring). I only gather and process resources, my tailoring is at 0/200. In the beginning I only processed hides because they don't need extra mats and put the wood in the bank until I had cash for wax or the people I gave resources to bought me wax. I had tier 4 crafters of all types in beta and knew it would require a lot of time and money to get any results.

Are you a loner or do you group with friends for quests, and if yes how often?
I play 2 chars at once, hunter and loremaster. I can "solo" all quests except those that need full groups. On my server there's a guardian and ministrel who play together and also play a lot, we're in the same level range. We gain a few levels on the full group quests and do them with just the 4(3) of us. The only exception to that was Greater Barrows, which we did (completely) with a full group.

But to answer your question from a normal player's perspective, I highly recommend playing with one or two friends. Many quests with a fellowship icon can easily be done with two players, especially if one of them is a hunter.

What are your repair tactics? Do you have purple items, and if yes, how much do they cost compared to the yellow ones?
Only repair single items when the game tells you they're about to break, which should never happen at low levels because you replace them so fast. Puples don't really cost that much to repair, except jewelry (they're fixing that next patch).

Are you rearranging your traits, and if yes how often?
Almost never. I only slotted useful ones. But even if I did rearrange them often, it doesn't cost much.

How about the other class traits? How much do the cost?
Fast Draw is the only really expensive one. The one you get from using Swift Bow only cost 1s. Most are around 11s from what I remember from beta. Enduring precision (lvl 30) was 11s or 22s. But if you ever remove that trait you're a dumbass and don't deserve to have any money :P

What about the race traits?
Race traits are 22s, I left Sylvan Shadows (first elf trait) until I had money to spare, but used the +20 trait as soon as I got it. All of the other first racial traits (uppercut, headbutt) are completely useless and a waste of silver. Can't remember what the hobbit one was but I assume it's useless too.

[Belechael]

Vodos I love you!

Now, this is a perfect traveler's log, from which anyone can draw his own conclusions.

Thank you very much.

Oh, and my most important conclusions are, unfortunately, the following:

1. A casual player without any warning will end up losing a considerable amount of money by repairing his items every time he can. I know I did, and I'm not a first time MMO player. Is a detailed guide going to be in the manual? I really doubt it.

2. Not all the professions are doable for an ordinary player who doesn't have a degree in microeconomics and management. The way things are right now everyone should pick Explorer and be done with it.

I have some propositions in the respective crafting thread for a well balanced crafting economy, but I won't repeat it here.

Thanks again Vodos.

[Kelt Miriel]

er im having a feeling this fast draw is bugged ethe for me or the majority of you because i have it and it certianly did not cost me 66 silver i assure you. I'm thinking something is wrong. Also, give the developers some time its the first week i'm sure they will change it!

[habanaman]

I agree the price is too high. I'm ignoring it at the moment. As I've no idea how effective " a medium amount" will be at increasing my combat speed, and since I got a boost to my barbed arrow (barbed fury, or something?) for the same slot which cost less than 2 silver to slot, I'm not going to pay over 60 S untill I'm a much wealthier elf.
Besides, since at level 15 we've got only one class slot, who's gonna have the cash to keep swapping in and out traits. Which is what i thought was the point of the system anyway.
Having to travel to a Bard, and pay a SMALL fee is penalty enough. Having said that, I've no idea how it works out in later levels. High prices may well be needed for the game to work, but surely at such a low level, and being many hunters first class trait they could have at least let us use it :(
Scrooges!

[Mordikay]

I don't know what you guys are doing wrong but 66 silver is nothing. I'm only lvl 14 atm and have pretty high crafting (doing much higher lvl items then i can wear) and 66 silver is not a lot really.

[Belechael]

I will have to repeat myself once again:

Please, when you take the time to write something concerning the amount of money you have so far in the game, also include some information about character, vocation, level, type of play, etc. This way the rest of us can evaluate our own situation and come to some conclusions.

Otherwise you are not helping at all.

Thank you.